Kerriebaby
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« on: June 19, 2007, 09:10: PM » |
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I had a customer in today, who had a query regarding her cats diet.
The cat in question is a four year old moggy, he has had treatment for crystals in the bladder ( was fed Iams for his first year, linked?) and he also suffers from chronic constipation. The vet prescribed a diet to help with the crystals and that just made him more bunged up.
The customer has now been self medicating, was told (supposedly by a cat savvy evt) that she should avoid foods with high levels of protein as that will stop the urine crystals and if she also feeds dry, then he wont get bunged up. She has been feeding the cheaper foods (Tesco Value and the like) obiviously because of the lower meat content, it is also lower in protein. As a result, the cat only gets bunged up every 6 weeks or so. She said that it is as if his bowel isnt strong enough to do its job, hence being constipated.
She has used liquid parafin to help him, and at one stage was using it 4 times per day, now she only allows a teaspoon a day.
I dont understand how the lower protein would stop him getting bunged up and crystals, I would have thought that a good quality food thats high in fibre would be better for him?
Just to add, my first thoughts were maybe feeding a more natural diet, but I am not allowed to recommend BARF diets.
we were all baffled about this, so if anyone can shed some light?
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IJF
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« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2007, 10:22: AM » |
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Sounds very strange to me. Cats are obligate carnivores and have more of a need for a high meat protein diet than dogs.
As regards struvite crystals (and urinary tract infections in general) many vets will recommend a wet diet to increase the water intake. Usually these have a higher meat protein content than dry diets. This contradicts the information your customer was given.
The only way I can see that a lower protein dry diet might help the blockages is because the food is so undigestible (full of grains and fillers) that it goes straight through the cat?
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smokeybear
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« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2007, 11:59: AM » |
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http//www.b-naturals.com/Sep2004.php http://www.b-naturals.com/May2004.phphttp://www.b-naturals.com/Dec2002.phphttp://www.b-naturals.com/Apr2003.phpfirst of all there are two different issues hear, kidney disease and/or stones/crystals. The two are not necessarily inextricably linked. There are a lot of myths about protein and kidney disease when it is phosphorus that is the element that needs to be considered. The treatment for crystals differs depending upon whether or not they are struvites or oxalate or others. Also the presence of crystals does not necessarily mean that there is an infection and the acidity/alkanility of the urine can be altered if suitable by some supplements. There are a lot of people regurgitating received "wisdom" but without the knowledge to support their opinions. Not sure if this helps |
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Unicorn
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« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2007, 06:57: PM » |
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I have a lot of experience with cats and bladder infections, and would recommend she stops feeding her cat dry food. Some cats don't drink much and the dry biscuits help to dehydrate the cat.
A diet based on wet food with the occasional biscuits is fine, but feeding only dry food is a cause of bladder infections, which can then lead to crystals etc.
The fact that the cat is also constipated suggests that the dry food is not helping his digestion.
My cat used to get bladder issues all the time, until I realised it was the biscuits causing the problem, she hasn't had any since I changed her diet and stopped her eating dry food.
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Kerriebaby
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« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2007, 07:02: PM » |
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What wet food do you feed Unicorn?
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claraclogs
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« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2007, 07:36: PM » |
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crystals actually have nothing to do with how much water the cat drinks. it is due to the body not correctly breaking down the minerals which are then filtered into the bladder. this can cause a problem as they can then clump together & in male cats you only need a cluster a bit bigger than a large salt grain to cause a blockage. this can either be caused by diet- the ones i have seen that are usually responsible is go-cat & brekkies. however it can be caused by a genetic fault which means the cat doesnt break down the minerals corrreclty. but in both cases a special diet is required afterwards. people used to think that dry food caused kidney problems beacuse of the cat not taking as much fluid in the food.allanimals know when they are thirsty & if a cat is fed dry food it will just drink more as wet food contains approx 80% water. a low protein diet is advised for renal failure. a cause of bladder infections, which can then lead to crystals - it is the other way round, a build up of crystals can lead to infection - imagine having a rough stone rattling around the delicate bladder surface. i have 3 males who have all been bought up on goodquality dry & the eldest is nearly 15- just had his annual blood tests which have shown no problems & he looks & acts like a5 year old. |
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Unicorn
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« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2007, 08:22: PM » |
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crystals actually have nothing to do with how much water the cat drinks Nowhere did I say that they did! & if a cat is fed dry food it will just drink more as wet food contains approx 80% water. This is not necessarily the case, some cats are poor water drinkers. My cat is one of these, I have to coax her to drink. Quote
a cause of bladder infections, which can then lead to crystals
- it is the other way round, a build up of crystals can lead to infection - imagine having a rough stone rattling around the delicate bladder surface.
i have 3 males who have all been bought up on goodquality dry & the eldest is nearly 15- just had his annual blood tests which have shown no problems & he looks & acts like a5 year old You have taken what I said out of context. You do not necessarily have to have crystals to cause an infection. You can simply have a bladder infection and not crystals. Also, not all cats fed dry food will be prone to bladder infections, but for some cats, the dry food will be a contributing factor. Take them off the dry food and the infections stop. |
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claraclogs
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« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2007, 08:31: PM » |
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crystals actually have nothing to do with how much water the cat drinks
Nowhere did I say that they did! sorry i thought that was what your post was suggesting. Some cats don't drink much and the dry biscuits help to dehydrate the cat. recommend she stops feeding her cat dry food. Some cats don't drink much and the dry biscuits help to dehydrate the cat. Also, not all cats fed dry food will be prone to bladder infections, but for some cats, the dry food will be a contributing factor but thats what i said too!i wasnt actively disagreeing with you or looking for an arguement- i was just stating what i know  some cats are poor water drinkers. My cat is one of these, I have to coax her to drink. sorry but i have never an animal not drink unless it is unwell or severly stressed. is your cat a house cat? |
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« Last Edit: June 20, 2007, 08:37: PM by claraclogs »
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Unicorn
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« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2007, 08:37: PM » |
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No, I was more suggesting that dry food can and does cause bladder infections in cats, especially if the cat is a poor drinker.
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nessie
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« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2007, 09:38: PM » |
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Poor lil cat, sounds like life is tough with both urinary problems and the constipation. I hope the owners manage to get him sorted.
Obesity and inactivity are other factors that could predispose a cat to these problems.
Good advice from Unicorn. It is advised that for both urinary tract conditions and constipation, a cat should be encouraged to drink as much as possible. Being independent little souls, this is not always easy. That's why wet food tends to be recommended over dry. Although I admit it is rather contrary as both hills and pedigree pet foods make dry prescription diets as well as canned to aid in the dissolution of crystals (by acidifying the urine in the case of struvite). Sounds bizarre but perhaps you could recommend a cat drinking water fountain kerrie? They are now becoming much more widely used and a lot of cats do like them.
Also good advice from SmokeyBear. There are certainly supplements that can be used (under veterinary supervison) that can help to alter the urine pH if a cat doesn't do well on or as in lots of cases - refuses to eat the prescription food.
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Kerriebaby
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« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2007, 09:41: PM » |
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The woman said that she hasnt taken the cat to the vet for over a year, because she felt that they were taking her money and not doing too much. They gave her a food for the crystals, but that made him bunged up.
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nessie
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« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2007, 09:59: PM » |
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Oh no, sounds like perhaps she should find a better vet! It's awful when you feel like you're getting nowhere and the animal is not improving. Both cases can unfortunatley be quite difficult to fully cure. Crystal formation tends to be recurrent and often there are recurrences even if the care is the best on the planet. Constipation is not generally thought of as a serious medical condition, but it can be - and it depends on what is causing it in the first place. Sometimes it may even be necessary to remove a portion of the bowel. That's obviously a worst case scenario, but I would definitely suggest for the cat's sake that the owner return to the vets - a different one that she/he has more confidence in if need be.
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Lara'sYorkies
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« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2007, 10:07: AM » |
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I agree about the wet food thing, my dads cat had a bladder infection (he is not overweight, a little underweight in fact). He was being fed dry iams. The vet advised us to put him on wet food, we put him on natures:menu and he has not had any problems since |
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