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Author Topic: DOG LICENSE  (Read 1245 times)
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Kerriebaby
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I oppose the selling of all animals via pet shops

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« Reply #15 on: January 08, 2007, 08:22: PM »

Maybe someone somewhere could put together a really good information pack, and have a national newspaper publish it, have a few big supermarkets onside, go into schools and some other biggy...bit off the wall I know... Rolling Eyes
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« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2007, 08:26: PM »

I do believe that it's an increasing problem.

Another popular way for puppy farmers to sell their pups is to place a litter in a private house, (I assume they get a commission). They would either have a bitch of that breed there which a naive person wouldn't realise was not the dam or more likely in the case of a collie or a gundog they would be told that the mother was out working. Or they are selling the pups for their brother, sister, mother, father or whatever who is in hospital, got a broken leg, having a baby, got the flu.

Recently two Springer Spaniel owners met each other here at a socialising session. They got talking and it turned out that they had got their pups from the same 'breeder'. Both had the same fictitious date of birth and they were amazed at how one brother could be twice the size of the other and that one had a docked tail and the other didn't. Rolling Eyes They both assumed their pups to be 11 weeks old and had had them for 3 weeks. It was clear that one of them was only about 8 weeks old, 9 weeks max so they had got him at 5 - 6 weeks (and no the vet hadn't picked up on it) and the other was nearer 15 weeks.
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« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2007, 08:29: PM »

 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Evil or Very Mad Twisted Evil
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« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2007, 08:42: PM »

i cant believe that people can still be so ignorant about buying a pup.
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« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2007, 08:54: PM »

Shocking really
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« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2007, 09:08: PM »

I do believe that it's an increasing problem.

Another popular way for puppy farmers to sell their pups is to place a litter in a private house, (I assume they get a commission). They would either have a bitch of that breed there which a naive person wouldn't realise was not the dam or more likely in the case of a collie or a gundog they would be told that the mother was out working.

I did not know about this. I am going to let our managing editor know about this as I feel it worthy of reporting. We (K9 Media) made a complaint to the Dogs Trust and Pet Advertising Advisory committee about what we felt were double standards in allowing puppy farms to be publicised. I include it below to give a gist of what we were moaning about. Apologies for it being so massive but it is relevant to what is being discussed here
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Dear EDITED,

Thank you for the email and puppy farm letter.

As the editor of K9 Magazine and as a person who has worked exclusively
within the dog world in a hands-on capacity since leaving school, I am
all too aware of the problems that are perpetuated by the abundance of
puppy farming and dog dealers in the UK.

It has always been a personal belief of mine that reducing the number of
puppy farmers and dog dealers can only be achieved by cutting off their
oxygen of publicity - in other words - by giving puppy farmers/dealers
nowhere to advertise or promote their wares, they will have little
motivation to continue their trade.

With this in mind, our company (K9 Media Ltd) established
our own charter for ethical dog breeding back in 1999 and any breeder
who wishes to advertise within any of our publications must agree and
conform to this charter which we believe was one of the forerunners in
the campaign to deny puppy farmers/dealers the opportunity to advertise.


To further enhance our message of encouraging responsible ownership, we
even take the step of completely shutting down our website
www.breederdirectory.co.uk for the entire month of December every year
in an effort to stop people attempting to acquire puppies at Christmas
time - this is despite the fact that we only work with ethically sound
breeders, who would not sell a puppy at this time anyway but it is a
move which both the breeders who use the site and people who visit
applaud and our decision is more based on the symbolic message this
action conveys. Of course, we lose out financially for a whole month by
not taking advertising but I think this is where the lines are blurred
with other publishers.

Myself and two colleagues actually had a meeting last year with EDITED
 and outlined our beliefs that denying puppy farmers/dealers the
opportunity to advertise was the absolute key to hurting their
'industry' along with an educational drive advising puppy purchasers of
what to look for when looking for a dog. We have and will continue to
promote this message very seriously

I do have a serious grievance though which I would like to air.

When we published the recent article sent to us by The Dogs Trust "Puppy
Farming Uncovered by Dogs Trust and BBC" -
http://www.k9magazine.com/viewarticle.php?sid=15&&vid=0&npage=&aid=794 -
in the original release it gave praise to The Pet Advertising Advisory
Group and more specifically to "advertising publications such as Loot,
Yellow Pages and Exchange & Mart" in applying tougher guidelines on
taking advertising from breeders or puppy sellers.

The first thing I did when I received the release was visit
www.petownersonline.com (Exchange & Mart's dedicated pet website).

The reason I went there straight away was because I remember very
clearly when I saw the site for the first time at last year's Crufts,
they had advertising on the site from breeders (dealers) whom we (K9
Media / BreederDirectory.co.uk ) would never have taken money from and
whose adverts would never have met the terms of our ethical breeding
charter.

Having now seen the company mentioned in positive terms in an article
about puppy farming, I decided to have a look and see if the same or
similar advertising was still being accepted.

My first search was for 'Labradors' - and the first advert displayed is
this:

EAST LONDON PUPPIES, All our kennels are veterinarily approved &
supervised. Excellent before & after sales care given. Vaccinated,
microchipped (pet logged registered), wormer & care package all included
in the price with written health care sheets. Miniature dachshund, Toy
Poodles, Labradors....

Then I performed a search for 'Westies' - 2 results were returned

ADORABLE WESTIES, MINIATURE SCHNAUZERS *Daschunds, Pug crosses,
Springers, Yorkie Crosses, ex cellent Licenced kennels,
www.pupsrus.co.uk 01239 841609/644 T

And

ATTENTION LOOK NO FURTHER *Alsatians, Akita's, Bassets, Beagles,
Bichons, Border Collies, Boxers, Cavaliers, Chihuahua's, Chows, Cockers,
Dobermans, Jacks, Labradors, Pugs, Pomeranian, Retrievers, Rottweilers,
Staffs, Shih-Tzus, Springers, Weimaraners, Whippets, Westies, Yorkies,
Crossbreeds....

(NOTE - No self-respecting breeder of German Shepherds would refer to
them as 'Alsatians')

Now I appreciate the distinction between a puppy farmer and a puppy
dealer is different but as I am sure you are aware, dealers very often
purchase from puppy farmers and the two very much go hand-in-glove, this
is why I find it incredibly hard to take that advertising such as this,
on a site which proudly displays its affiliation with The Pet
Advertising Advisory Group and is also noted is positive terms in
editorial about The Dogs Trust's (commendable) drive to stamp out puppy
farming, is commonplace.

I found these ads with just two searches, both of which are for popular
breeds and therefore breeds which are also popular with puppy
farmers/dealers (I refer to them in the same vein as in nearly all
cases, they operate in tandem)

I found similar advertising on Yell.com - see below:

J.W Raymond
Classification: Dog Breeders
• BREEDERS OF QUALITY PUPPIES • CAVALIER KING CHARLES SPANIELS •
LABRADORS -YELLOW/BLK & CHOC • BORDER & CAIRN TERRIERS • STAFFORDSHIRE
BULL TERRIERS • FULLY LICENSED & INSURED

And again on Loot.com - see below:

HOT DOG KENNELS We have available: Basset Hounds £475, Basset Crosses
£250, Labs £300, Retrievers £325, Bichon Frise £375, Boxers £425, G.S.D
£275, Cockers £300, Westies £335, Shih Tzus £325, Jack Russells £175,
Rottweilers £375, Poms £325, Staffs £360, Cavaliers £350, Yorkies £325.
All wormed w/ first injection & puppy pack. Call 01268 761786 / 07863
145389 More >>

I have attached a word document with screen grabs of these ads and I
would also point out that I did not have to look hard to find these
adverts at all and I stopped after just a couple of searches rather than
find similar ads to simply emphasise my point.

As you are aware, puppy farmers/dealers earn their living through
selling lots of pups all year round and they are therefore very adept at
using advertising to ensure they have a high degree of visibility all of
the time whether they even have puppies available or not.

The drive to cut down on the number of unwanted dogs and reduce the
weight of dogs that end up in the rescue system of Great Britain is
something very important to me personally and that is echoed by our
company.

I believe that unscrupulous breeders/farmers/dealers who are involved in
the sale of dogs for nothing more than commercial gain is one of if not
THE largest contributing factors to this problem.

With this in mind none of the adverts I have mentioned in this email or
shown in the attached document would have been accepted by us - in fact
- despite the obvious difference in financial capabilities between our
company and Exchange and Mart, Yell and Loot, we turn down advertising
of this nature on a weekly basis as it does not comply with our charter
for ethical dog breeding - this is also in spite of the fact that our
business makes its living from advertising just the same as the
companies mentioned above and we are not endorsed by or endorsers of The
Pet Advertising Advisory Group .

I do hope you can see why I felt the need to write to you with my
concerns as I share the same desire as Dogs Trust to stamp down on puppy
farms and dealers and equally I believe that cutting their route to
market by denying them the opportunity to advertise is the key to
success.

It is, in my opinion, a mockery for companies who proudly display their
affiliation with The Pet Advertising Advisory Group to then accept
advertising which is clearly not from specialist breeders. Equally I
believe it sends out the wrong message to (the millions) of people who
use these company's publications to locate breeders, who may feel an
enhanced degree of safety in the knowledge that they are only displaying
advertising from ethical, dedicated dog breeders due to an affiliation
with The Pet Advertising Advisory Group.

May I finish by stressing that none of what I have written is aimed as
criticism at Dogs Trust, your cause is incredibly worthwhile and one
which we have been championing for the past few years, I simply felt the
need to alert you to what I perceive to be a contradiction between
perceived praise for companies who are using The Pet Advertising
Advisory Group whilst still accepting advertising which we believe to be
detrimental to the overall campaign to stamp out puppy farming.

Kind Regards
Ryan O'Meara

Editor in Chief
K9 Magazine
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« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2007, 09:11: PM »

week in week out the same puppy farmers advertises in our freeads as reputable. guaranteed by vets LOL.
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Kerriebaby
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« Reply #22 on: January 08, 2007, 09:55: PM »

same here. pictures of cute puppies hundreds of breeds same number same blurb
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sarabe
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« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2007, 10:29: PM »

The PAC supports licensed dealers. Tougher guidelines for advertising in Exchange and Mart. Yeah right. Rolling Eyes  I am shocked that the Dog's Trust are promoting them.

What was their response Ryan? 

Well done on you stance on advertising from breeders.
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Kerriebaby
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« Reply #24 on: January 08, 2007, 10:33: PM »

That is shocking
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« Reply #25 on: January 08, 2007, 10:36: PM »

Unfortunately whilst I am the copyright owner of the letter I wrote to them and am able to publish it here, their response is protected by their copyright but I can say there is no longer any pet website from Exchange and Mart and I think the Dogs Trust have actually had a re-think about promoting people who are happy to simply say they are part of some charter but not actually back it up with any action so changes have happened for the better since I wrote that letter. Sadly, even if all the big guys did take a more ethical stance, someone would come in and offer an outlet to puppy farmers so widespread education, as has been pointed out in this thread, is the real key.
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sarabe
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« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2007, 10:42: PM »

Quote
I can say there is no longer any pet website from Exchange and Mart and I think the Dogs Trust have actually had a re-think

Well that's good, anyway.
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I think animal testing is a terrible idea. They get all nervous and then they give the wrong answers.
Kerriebaby
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« Reply #27 on: January 08, 2007, 10:44: PM »

I just find it odd that people can go to these places, and not think thats having so many puppies in one place isnt wrong!
Last year I looked into getting a beagle, and the few breeders I found were literally overrun with Pups..I walked away..
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sarabe
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« Reply #28 on: January 08, 2007, 10:59: PM »

I might do a poll of all our puppy owners.

We do have a question on the enrolment form about where they got puppy from. Private home, breeder, rescue but I could maybe do a quick survey to see how many of them are aware of puppy farms and dealers. That would be interesting.
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I think animal testing is a terrible idea. They get all nervous and then they give the wrong answers.
nuttykitten
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« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2007, 06:29: PM »

I think we should bring back the dog license and training for the owners I think this would be a good idea to stop silly owners as well as silly breeders and if we had dog licenses we wouldnt have half as much problms as we have now and it will stop the big I am`s with there fashion victim ect Staffie ,Rotties ,GSD.
Let me know how you feel about this?
i was just saying about this in the general dogchat.
i think after recent events, it should be made law that you have to have a licence if you want to own a fighting dogbreed.
and the potential owner should be thouroghley tested, if he/she is stable enough, to own such a dog.
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